Umthi - An Ode to Heritage, Strength, and Self-Worth

Ramon Vela (02:03.417)
Welcome back everyone. This is going to be an amazing show. I have with me Lolita Sanders, who is the founder of Umti. Welcome to the show.

Lolita Sanders (02:35.489)
Thank you so much. for having me. Really appreciate it.

Ramon Vela (02:37.964)
Well, appreciate you. Yeah, well, thank you. I appreciate you making time. You're overseas right now. If you don't mind telling the audience where you located right now.

Lolita Sanders (02:47.801)
I am based in London and this has been sort of my home for the last 20 years, but I grew up in South Africa.

Ramon Vela (02:55.522)
Wow, well, that's fantastic. Hopefully we get a little bit more history on that. But I appreciate you making time. I know it's dinner time for you guys. So I appreciate you spending a little bit time with me and my audience and kind of helping us learn more about UMT and why you do what you do and why our audience should know about it. Before we do that, I have a signature question.

And it basically is a gratitude question. I ask, do this for two reasons. Maybe there's a little bit more than that, but two basic reasons. One is I'm a big believer in gratitude. I have had some really, really difficult moments in my life when back in the late 2000s, early 2010s, I had a business I had to close. It really took a lot out of me, both physically, mentally.

emotionally, financially, and it was just a terrible moment in my life. And gratitude is one of those things that helped me kind of get out of that dark night of the soul. And so now I love to talk about it, love to promote it, and it's free. So if anyone is out there feeling stress or anxiety, gratitude is a great way to relieve stress, a great way to relieve anxiety. And like I said, it's free. So you can journal, you can pray, you can meditate like I do.

Anyhow you do it, I think it's incredibly powerful. So that's my little commercial gratitude. But the other reason why I ask it is that it is very easy for consumers to see products online or on the shelf and simply think, oh, it's just some faceless corporation, right? Like they don't see the people behind the companies or the brands. And so they just look and think, oh, it's just some faceless corporation. It could be big, it could be small. It doesn't really...

They don't really know, so it doesn't really matter to them. But I want the listeners to know that the people that we have on this show and the brands that we feature have real people behind them who care deeply about their products, care deeply about their communities, who care about the quality of the products, and basically bleed, sweat, and tear over bringing a product to market. I want people to get to know who they are. And I want them to know who you are, Lulia. So with that said,

Ramon Vela (05:15.543)
Can you share a moment or a memory when someone did something for you that just made you feel grateful because it meant that they believed in you, your vision, or your potential?

Lolita Sanders (05:25.223)
Absolutely. Unfortunately, there's two moments, can't choose between the two that comes to mind that stands out for me. And both moved me really deeply because they weren't just acts of kindness, they were expression of real belief in me and what I'm trying to build. The first one was at a festival with a friend of mine and I overheard

She's been a lifelong friend of no-nation C, was three years old. We've been friends for over 40 years old. that's giving away my age. And she was talking to somebody, but I was not in the conversation. I was having a conversation with somebody else. But the way that she was describing how proud she was of me and it just landed differently. mean, she's told me numerous of times how proud she is and all of that.

Ramon Vela (05:57.666)
Hehehe.

Lolita Sanders (06:19.593)
But this time it just, just hearing her to a total stranger and the sincerity and the pride that she had in her voice. I don't know what made this time so different, but it just landed differently where I had to take a pause literally and basically just go, my God, my friend is truly, truly proud of me and what I've done and truly believe in my whole journey and stuff.

Ramon Vela (06:42.189)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (06:48.541)
So yeah, no, was, yeah, that meant so much to me. I don't actually know that you knew that I was listening into a conversation.

Ramon Vela (06:55.591)
Thank

Lolita Sanders (06:58.793)
The second one is more of a newer friend. She's one of a friend, a mum friend that I've met, but she's become a really, really dear, dear, friend of mine. was starting up in, of course, I'm bootstrapping the company. So I was having some financial difficulty trying to buy stock and so forth for the company to set it off. And she herself...

In that time, she was going through a really difficult time financially herself and didn't know she was financially unstable because her, don't know how to say it, but her marriage had broken up. She didn't know what was going to happen. And of course, in that same time, a really painful time as well for her where her dad passed away and her dad had left us a little bit of money. And it wasn't a big sum of money.

But the fact that the first thing that she said to me is just like, would like to do something good with the money that my dad has left me. And I would love to give you a loan. No questions asked, no interest, no time period to pay back. And for her to share that with me just hit me really hard and I was sobbing. Firstly, I couldn't accept it. And she was just like, look.

My dad would have wanted this and I just want to carry on a legacy for my dad. And for her to believe that this is her dad's legacy into somebody else's legacy. And this was basically in the beginning of me. I didn't even know where Ulty would go at this stage. It was just literally just my dream, trying to visualize this dream. So yeah, those are the two sort of that really made me sort of stand still and sort of take stock a little bit in going, yes.

Ramon Vela (08:41.234)
yeah. Well, I mean,

Lolita Sanders (08:43.539)
People do believe in me and people would like to see me succeed. yeah.

Ramon Vela (08:48.319)
No, I love that. I always refer to someone actually, I got this from someone else, but I love the phrase that when you hear someone say something to you or when someone says something to you and it hits you right at that right moment when you need it, it's like a transfer of belief. It's like their words, you know.

Lolita Sanders (09:07.561)
Mm.

Ramon Vela (09:11.143)
hit you at the right time or hit you in such a way where you think like, wow, I just can't like, this is just so meaningful to me. And it really re-energizes you and just makes you feel good. And it makes you feel like, okay, I can keep going because there are moments in our lives, especially in this journey for entrepreneurship, where things get really tough. You know, like you said, sometimes you don't have money to buy inventory or materials. Sometimes you are struggling to make payments.

I mean, this is not an easy road. And so there will be times that where things will test you. And those little words of encouragement, that transfer of belief is just so powerful sometimes because it just helps you kind of take that next step or continue on, especially if you if you go through times, which every entrepreneur does when they feel like, OK, I'm quitting, like I don't want to continue doing this anymore.

And it happens. So thank you for sharing that. I mean, that's, you know, I love that. And I love when people, you're fortunate to have people around you who support you and want to see you succeed and are proud of what you've accomplished. So that's fantastic.

Lolita Sanders (10:22.535)
No, absolutely. I'm very, very grateful for them. I'm grateful for my community that I'm building as well. As I said, there's so many that I can choose from, but these two sort of stood out for me as the ones that had hit me to the core of my heart where I've literally, I felt it deeply.

Ramon Vela (10:35.585)
Yeah.

Ramon Vela (10:42.753)
Wow. No, I appreciate that. So let's get started. There is a reason why your friend was so proud of you. so in some ways, I would love for you to kind of put yourself in your friend's eyes. And what is it that she sees about the brand and about what you're doing that made her so proud? Like if you were to put yourself in her eyes, know that.

Lolita Sanders (10:42.985)
tell you.

Ramon Vela (11:10.957)
I know that you're not, that's hard to do, but I mean, just imagine what was it you think that really made her feel so proud about the brand?

Lolita Sanders (11:21.683)
think we grew up in South Africa together. As I said, she's, I've known her since she was three years old. I guess also growing up in South Africa, little girls like us, we grew up in the township and we, during apartheid era, especially as a young sort of woman,

It was... We weren't given the privilege... the word privilege to dream.

because there was nothing really out there to dream about. And it was all about survival. From a day to day survival. And I think, yeah, so when she was uttering those words, that's when it was just like, my word, we've come so far. We've never would have thought that we ended up in London because as well for only up until 1994,

Ramon Vela (12:05.687)
Mm-hmm.

Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (12:30.153)
We didn't own passports. Passports weren't for black people. We... In our own country, we were treated as foreigners.

Ramon Vela (12:32.119)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (12:45.031)
as if we were the people that came, even though we were there before everybody else came. So yeah, and I think that is what literally, just seeing myself through her, because to believe in ourselves as well, I find it through the years, I find it hard. It was one of my challenges to have the confidence with what I can do and what my value is in life.

Ramon Vela (12:50.423)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (13:13.535)
And umti has sort of become sort of my ode to myself, to my hair, to my heritage. And to just stand strong and realize that I also matter and I have something of value to give.

Ramon Vela (13:32.598)
Wow, that is very powerful. And it's unfortunate that you had to experience that. And I will say that it really is, it's really one of the most devastating things that I can ever imagine for anyone, much less a child, is to not have the ability to have hope or slash dream about the future.

where your life is so, and I haven't experienced it personally, but I know people who have experienced things like this, where your life is simply all about survival and you can't dream or you can't have hope for the future. Like you can't imagine yourself in another situation. You can't imagine yourself doing something else differently. You can't imagine having the things that maybe other people might have.

You simply do not have any of that because it has been taken from you or not provided to you. And so many people take that for granted. mean, people take a lot for granted. As matter of fact, I had this conversation once with someone a while ago and it was about high school. And they were telling me, my son or my daughter, I can't remember which, they're going to go to high school and then...

you they were talking about what colleges are going to go to and so forth. And I told them that, you know, it's so interesting how depending on where you ask that question and where, you know, what socioeconomic status you're asking it, it is not a presumption. It's like some people will say, my, you know, I want them to finish high school and then go to college. And then you ask another person that and they're just like, I just,

Like want them to finish. Like I just want them to finish before, you know, and not, you know, have this happen or have that happen or whatever. It's like, it's the expectation people, I don't know how to say this, but if we don't have that expectation, if we don't have that hope, if we don't have that dream, it's, it's, it's, it's like the most devastating thing. And the fact that you were able to, to push through that and get to where you are.

Ramon Vela (15:55.456)
I can see how proud, how your friend will be proud. I'm proud of you. I'm just, know, because I know how difficult that is. know how, most people don't even realize it. They think, well, you know, you know, give them some money. can uproot yourself, whatever, or pull yourself on your bootstraps or whatever it is people say. People don't realize that we sometimes presume and say, I have this and everyone I know has this.

Lolita Sanders (16:02.022)
Thank you.

Ramon Vela (16:22.465)
But if they ever met someone or someplace where that did not have that, it is really a devastating thing to put upon someone and for someone also to overcome.

Lolita Sanders (16:35.911)
Yeah, it's so true.

Ramon Vela (16:38.097)
Yeah, just, I, there's such a powerful story what you just said. So thank you for sharing that. so how did UMT start? mean, this is so, I mean, feel free to talk a little bit about your background too. Like, you know, where you were when you started UMT, UMT and how did it, how did the concept start and then what were those next steps?

Lolita Sanders (17:06.239)
I started UMT when I had medicine-induced alopecia. So my hair started falling out and it literally in lumps. And due to the medication that I was on and I felt so lost. I was feeling better from the medication, but emotionally I was just being drained by my hair. As you know, our hair is, even though I grew up in a culture where

my hair wasn't considered a thing of beauty. The color of my skin, the size of my nose, my lips, none of those were, it didn't conform to the normal beauty standards that was in there. And living in South Africa, was, the hair was even of a political issue where your race was sometimes determined if a pencil could go in through your hair or not. So it comes from a

Hence I said before, it's an ode to my hair because I had to overcome all those issues while Umti allowed me to overcome these issues. And I'm still overcoming it. It's a process.

So my hair was falling out. I literally had to dig deep and basically in the middle of the night going, you know what, I come from a lineage of herbalists. My grandfather was a herbalist. My mother used to make medicine for our neighbors, friends and family. And I remember just a joy I used to feel of people coming back to come and thank her when the medicine had worked and going, my God, that's the wonder of what.

nature has to give. I've never been to a doctor either until I was in my teens because everything, all our childhood ailments and things were treated with herbs and around. So from a young age I always knew that herbs, everything that we need is in nature.

Ramon Vela (19:11.489)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (19:12.633)
everything for us to heal is the nature. So I guess digging from that, I went back to basically, okay, I'm having this issue. It's not going away. I've tried everything that's on the market. Everything is either full of toxin or it's exasperating and then the issues that I was having and nothing was really effective. That was basically the first thing, but I should have known this because I grew up where, skin whitening.

was a thing in South Africa because everybody didn't want it to be black because you weren't seen as a human, with subhuman as such growing up in South Africa and also seeing the devastating effect of that. So I always knew that there was something in products that weren't good for us. And when I had my son, that's when I stopped relaxing. I stopped because I didn't want it for my sort of vanity of how...

Ramon Vela (19:45.901)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (20:10.427)
I wanted to be seen in the world by relaxing my hand, putting all those toxins. It was okay for me, but it wasn't okay for my fetus. I don't know if it was he or she, but my fetus, he didn't ask for all of this and my bad habits, I shouldn't be transferring on to him. So that was 50 years ago where I stopped relaxing. I started going really natural and basically doing...

doing products for them and for myself, but never really delved into haircare until I had my hair loss. And nothing, as I said, was working. I was using from the most expensive brands to whatever was on the shelf, but couldn't see the results. And just tap back and literally went, you know what? I do everything so naturally. Why don't I just make myself a shampoo and a conditioner and start from there?

Ramon Vela (20:44.48)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (21:04.711)
So I started playing around with herbs that I knew my parents were using in the past and started seeing a little bit of results. And then my friends started seeing, friends and neighbors started seeing the effects of my hair and going, my God, your hair is growing, your hair's texture is starting to feel softer. What's going on? So the process started where basically I did for about two years, I was making individual products with different friends of mine.

didn't realize that this was my research and development stage as such and came to realize that we were all hitting the same issues. Either our hair was thinning, breakage, dryness, damage from heat and of course chemical treatment. So I thought, you know what? I looked around at my family. I also have a mixed race family. My husband is Australian. So our kids are mixed race.

And it's like, OK, I don't want a product that's just for me. I want a product that is inclusive. I want my children to feel proud of using it. I want my husband's family to feel proud of using it. And I also want my family to feel proud of using it. Instead of having a hair product that's dividing, there's so many divisions already. They have so many things to navigate as being coming from a mixed sort of heritage background.

So I thought, you know what, if I'm going to serve this, it needs to be something that's inclusive. It needs to be something that closes deep to me where I'm taking from nature, but also what goes down the drain needs to be also all our ingredients are biodegradable. There's no toxins, there's no microplastics because I didn't want it to do the...

the 360 back into my drinking water, into the agricultures, into the fish that I eat and stuff. I wanted a brand with integrity because I realized that the black community wasn't served with integrity, especially in the hair and skincare. And that's where basically the stand or the ethos of, of umtiwas, it has to be healthy for us and healthy for the environment. And that's where they're at.

Ramon Vela (23:25.899)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (23:27.455)
where the name also came about umti which means tree in Xhosa which is a nod to my heritage, a nod to my lineage of herbalist Xhosa family or ancestors and yeah just being respectful, respectful on what we put on ourselves and also respectful what we allow to seep into the, back into.

into Mother Earth. We don't have a plan B, there's no plan B. And somehow we, as a brand, I wanted to be part of the solution and not the problem. I didn't just want to put a brand out there just for the sake, it's helping or seems to be helping, but wanted it to something to be deeper because if this is, if I'm bestowed with all this knowledge through my lineage, I wanted it to mean something.

Ramon Vela (24:05.27)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (24:22.737)
if I'm leaving behind a legacy for my children.

Ramon Vela (24:26.369)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (24:27.795)
I want there to be integrity, honesty and thanks. And that's how I started in growing empty. And I think that also had landed a hence with my friends and everyone that started using empty.

Ramon Vela (24:40.3)
Well, I love that. I love that that sort of values based branding that you have there. And and I think that's I think it's important.

because you have, it sounds like you very clearly have your North Star and your why in terms of what you're doing. And on top of all that, that is you have a product that definitely has appeal to a lot of people, I think, because, you know.

Lolita Sanders (25:03.839)
Definitely.

Ramon Vela (25:18.828)
there are a variety of different trends in hair care and so forth, but the bottom line is that there's so many products out there that have all sorts of chemicals and that may or may not be the best for you and so forth. And I think a lot of people do want an alternative. They do want something that's good for them, but also good for the environment and also effective. And so something that they could work with. And I'm assuming that the

Lolita Sanders (25:43.54)
Hmm.

Ramon Vela (25:48.669)
however, however they're having trouble, whether it's because of the chemicals or because of the shampoos or because of the things that they've used, is t well, let me just, let me rephrase that is can t help people, with hair loss or with strengthening their hair, regardless of how that happened, whether it's, you know, chemicals or, know sometimes people, you know, would

curled hair and a lot of heat, guess, you know, can have issues and so forth. You would, is it made for specifically for certain types of hair or is it made for certain types of like chemical treated or heat treated or walk us through that a little bit.

Lolita Sanders (26:35.455)
The best way of describing it, I'd see it as a three layer system that I went in with empty. So anybody can use it from chemical treated to your hair loss through damage, heat damage, all different types of sort of issues that we experience as such.

Because we have herbs, we use real herbs as well. That's makes us a little bit different. Instead of using extract, we use real herbs, nothing. So we use the coca-cocci of Amla, which is for strengthening, hibiscus, which helps with your scalp bio. Because everything with hair starts on our scalp. If our scalp isn't healthy, and that's what's my issue, I knew when I was touching my hair during this stage, my scalp was really tender. So I knew there was inflammation.

in there. So I had to treat the inflammation with it. So there's loads of inflammation fighting ingredients as well, oils and stuff like your black seed oil and your endorobal oil, which are strong anti-inflammatories by itself. And then strengthening sort of herbs like your amla, your fenugreek, your marshmallow root, full of silica, just to bring back the bounce back and the healthiness and I think I also stayed away from microplastics, which you see in most, especially

catered to the textured hair community. You find loads of microplastics in products. And I was finding that, as I was telling one of my customers, if you can carry water in a plastic bag, now imagine if you coat your hair in that plastic, nothing is penetrating where it's supposed to be. So you're not allowing, even though the plastic is there to keep the water in, but that water doesn't last long.

you need to basically water to being entered. And by having a microplastic thing, that's why we don't have any microplastics now, they're Of course, microplastic, I don't buy it degraded either. So it was a no-no. yeah, it was sort of certain things that, we have our herbs, then we have our gorgeous butters, which we ranges from using, there's a little bit of shea butter.

Ramon Vela (28:34.86)
you

Lolita Sanders (28:55.619)
But we use mostly mango butter and your argan butter in there just to give that creaminess. We've also, through this two years of testing, trying to take out things that were toxic and then fill it in with really good ingredients and trying to see if that stability, if the product would stay stable and seeing where we can push even with our emulsifiers, which is the mixture of

Ramon Vela (29:16.49)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (29:22.591)
but gets water and oil to mix in most of the conditions. So even with those, we were trying to see how far we can stretch those, that the product is still good and basically staying stable, but also being tested in the labs that it is right for consumer to use and not causing damage and causing toxicity and things like that.

Ramon Vela (29:25.292)
Thank you.

Ramon Vela (29:52.169)
it

Lolita Sanders (29:52.552)
I think that was the question I went off on.

Ramon Vela (29:55.083)
Yeah, and I'm wondering, no, no, you gave a great answer and I just want to of reaffirm this. So for instance, if I have, or if someone has thinning hair or hair that seems flat, you know, because it's been color treated or whatever, you know, what damage in my head I've incurred, would this, would UMT be able to help them?

Lolita Sanders (30:23.711)
Yes, absolutely. And our reviews state for ourselves. Most of my customers are, because I call it a hair pain, all those issues. Hopefully I coined the term hair pain. So most of them are in a really vulnerable stage and don't want to give the reviews, but would personally send me notes either by email or telephone call.

Ramon Vela (30:34.401)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (30:37.772)
Thank

Lolita Sanders (30:49.379)
or at my pop-ups, then I would hear the real stories. But I'm never recording these because of that mutual respect. They trust me and I trust, they trust me with their vulnerability and for me to serve them that I cannot let their stories out because it's their pain. It's their, their vulnerability-ness, their, and not many people are confident enough to share it. We're only,

after basically having come through on the other side, we're more confident to tell our story. But when you are in that pain or when your hair is ill, it's hard to basically sort of get those pain points. And I'm not a pushy person either, because I come from a point of view, I'm going to respect you and your space and your boundaries. And I'm not going to push on trying to push you because

what you are saying to me can save my brand in another way. So, but those that do have the confidence enough, yeah, leaves amazing reviews. the, like two weeks ago, for instance, I was at a market, a pop-up market, sorry, I'm just going to do that. Sorry, it's the light that's coming through in the UK. Yes. And,

Ramon Vela (31:49.996)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (32:09.322)
Yeah, it's okay.

Lolita Sanders (32:15.175)
I came to realize that out of all the people that came through through this market, 60 % were returning customers traveling from across London to come and see me at this market. And that fed me with so much fire in my belly going, my word, I am doing the right thing. I am making a difference and Umti is making a difference. Are we coining it? It's the Umti magic.

Whenever someone is like, it's the empty magic. Basically from your itchy scalp. Because we don't just create products for styling. Our emphasis is on scalp and hair health. So when your scalp is in optimum and your scalp biome is working and is peak, all the other issues becomes a second to nature because you have a healthier scalp. There's no...

Ramon Vela (32:57.493)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (33:12.089)
no inflammation in your follicles, things start growing, your follicles start behaving, more blood flow gets in. So we have ingredients like your fenugreek to get the blood flow, basically stimulating the blood flow to the follicles and things like that. And also some of it are TPH blockers as well.

Ramon Vela (33:27.52)
Continue.

Ramon Vela (33:31.388)
And out of curiosity, I we briefly mentioned it, this is a little bit of a tangent, but I'm just curious. Does hair color or coloring your hair damage your scalp and your hair follicles?

Lolita Sanders (33:37.619)
tasting.

Lolita Sanders (33:45.727)
Some can because if you're taking away the colour of your hair, you're then opening up those cuticles for it, basically for the colour that you're stripping, sort of the layers of the... for that colour to deposit into the hair strands. So, yeah, there is some damage that can be done to the hair. And sometimes as well, if it's too harsh of a hair dye, it can sometimes, if you have a sensitive scalp...

And I always tell people, if your skin is sensitive, that means your scalp is also sensitive because we seem to treat our scalp as something different than the rest of our skin, but it's one, is that one? It's the same thing.

Ramon Vela (34:24.436)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Ramon Vela (34:28.918)
Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. I don't think people think of it the same as like, let's say, know, putting lotion on your skin and or your hands or your face or something like that. let me just mention this really quick. Everyone out there, if you want to take a look at what we're talking about, you can go to umt.co.uk. Now umt is actually spelled U-M-T-H-I dot C-O dot U-K.

Umt is spelled U-M-T-H-I, umt with the H silent dot C-O dot U-K is the website. reason why I asked that is, so I, so my father died when I was very young and I, don't know if this was a cause for this, but surely thereafter I started getting gray hair and, and it started coming on very quickly.

and I would get it all over the sides and for a while they're kind of cool and so forth. But by the time I was a senior in high school, it was very noticeable. And so I had a friend of mine who during first year in college was telling me like, you should color it. At the time, maybe now it would have been cool. I see kids with like gray hair all the time and...

Lolita Sanders (35:36.02)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (35:49.803)
You know, maybe now it'd be cool, but back then it wasn't like back then I felt kind of weird. So I started coloring my hair and, I colored my hair for many, many years, like almost my entire life, you know, thus far, except for the last four, four years. And then I got to a point where I just felt like, know what? I'm just tired of doing this. Like it's going to be gray. It's going to be gray. So, you know, it is what it is, but I noticed that my hair sort of thinning out.

Lolita Sanders (36:03.892)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (36:17.612)
I felt like I was thinning out a little bit on top and I didn't know if it was because of the hair colors that I was using and so forth. So when I stopped, I just started taking better care of my head, my hair, you know. then now it's like my hair is, it's actually kind of coming back a little bit. You know, the fullness of the hair, I'm even seeing new hair growth and even so my hair is coming on black again.

you know, like the color is actually coming like it. And I often wonder, like, what was I doing to my hair all this year? Like, was I really like damaging it so badly? Because now that I've stopped, it's been a few years now, but now I'm, and I've been taking better care of my hair using, you know, products to help. And it feels like my hair is almost like coming back now. It feels like it was maybe stuck and I, I'm assuming it was, it had to do with the scalp and it has to do with the follicles and maybe I just, it was

malnourished or I don't even know what the terminology would be, but that was just, that's kind of my story and I sense a lot of people might have that kind of issue.

Lolita Sanders (37:24.581)
No, you know, you're completely right. As you said, you know, with the with your father's death, which is a really stressful time. So stress can really affect us in so many ways when our body is in a stress mode. So what happens is our hair and our nails are not seen as non-essential. So every nutrients will then be transported to the organs that needs to keep you alive.

Ramon Vela (37:51.18)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (37:53.44)
hair and nails are the last to get the nutrients. That's just when we are pregnant as well, the baby takes everything literally without the care of the host. And I think it's the same when we go through stress. So stress is one of the things that basically can cause our hair to fall out, our hair to go gray. So I guess...

Ramon Vela (37:56.15)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (38:02.198)
Yeah.

Ramon Vela (38:06.977)
Yeah.

Ramon Vela (38:16.012)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (38:21.629)
Stress will always be there. It's just finding ways of dealing with it in a healthier way. Because life is stressful and we can't say, have a life without stress. It would be lovely, but it's not attainable. But it's how we sort of manage our stress levels and giving that time back to us. And because of constant die and...

Ramon Vela (38:28.78)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (38:33.718)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lolita Sanders (38:48.231)
I guess even relaxes in that form because relaxes also by changing the structure of the hair to get the hair all straight and so on. So those are quite toxic and being on our scalp constantly can affect our follicles.

Ramon Vela (38:56.652)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (39:07.921)
in many ways. And of course, our follicles, once it's inflamed or it is, it starts starving itself from oxygen and getting smaller and thinner and closer to each other. So the hair doesn't really grow out of it. But once we start doing healthier ways, eating healthier, looking, having the right products into our hair, making sure that our skull biome is in the correct pH.

Ramon Vela (39:09.068)
Hmm.

Ramon Vela (39:21.132)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (39:36.999)
And even our shampoo is also pH. It's a pH of five. So that basically it's not fighting against our skin pH, which is about normally around about seven, I think. So it's making it easier for those things to sort of form and to heal and also having these herbs which are known to work on our epidermis and stuff. Like for instance, amla, which most people don't know about it, it's Indian gooseberry.

Ramon Vela (39:50.048)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (40:06.877)
really it's a sort of green little berry gooseberry but it's really bitter as such but it's also known as such a great super food and I grew up with amla literally from drinking amla to putting amla on as a face mask to amla in our hair to treating our hair giving it that conditioning that it needs and once you start caring for your hair as you can self-attain once you start

using and caring for your hair, taking out the things that are causing and exasperating the problems, your hair starts coming back and starts behaving in the way that you hope it should. And that was one of my biggest lessons actually with them too, is all about scalp health and keeping that healthy and also feeding it what it needs.

Ramon Vela (40:46.806)
Mm-hmm. And I'm curious.

Ramon Vela (40:58.304)
Well, and I was just going to mention that it feels like the product is for anyone who just wants healthy scalp and hair. But I mean, are there people who are to your product because of, I don't know, different phase of life? Like, for instance, you mentioned pregnancy, right? Like people who are pregnant, might, their hair might thin out, they might change, it might fall out a little bit. Because as you mentioned, all the resources are going to the child.

Lolita Sanders (41:07.561)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (41:24.041)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (41:27.89)
And so the hair and nails are the last to get any of the nutrients and so forth of the body. Is there any specific group of people that like, you think about like your main customers, do you have like a main customer or is it really just anyone who just wants a healthy set of hair, healthy hair?

Lolita Sanders (41:48.415)
From doing this, I've got three different main customers. I've got your customers that are going through the menopause and of course, postpartum, that are having their hair issues. I have the customer that is all about sustainability and wanting non-toxic products on themselves, and also the customer that cares about the environment. So all even our containers are in recycle.

recycled aluminium. So they've been around for years. And then just getting recycled over and over. So yes, I have the environmental conscious buyer, the buyer that doesn't want any toxins in their things and staying away from toxins. Either they had cancer and now suddenly aware of what they put on themselves. Because if you think about our skin, even though it's our biggest organ,

Ramon Vela (42:31.104)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (42:46.399)
and it protects ourselves as our body of armor but it allows everything that you put on it through into our bloodstream. Hence the easiest way of explaining this to somebody who doesn't get it is you know the nicotine patches. Why? On our skin because it gets through into our bloodstream. Your HRT gels.

Ramon Vela (43:02.049)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (43:09.363)
we rub on our skin because it goes into our bloodstream and that's how we treat it. So even though it's a protector, it's quite permeable, things go through it. So you have the conscious that knows from, don't want any toxins. So I have those clients and I have the clients that basically go, my word, I'm having hair issues.

My hair's either thinning, either falling out or breaking, not getting enough moisture. So yeah, I would say, yeah, twofold. Like a fork in the thing. But all of them, yeah, just wanting something that is effective and is effective on those fronts.

Ramon Vela (43:49.901)
Yeah, well, it sounds amazing. And I think a lot of people have, you know, I think the same trend is happening with hair also, not as much as with like other trends, but I think more and more people want to...

achieve some of these things, know, like the sustainability, they want something that's organic, they want something that's healthy. There's all sorts of like, talk now about microplastics and things like that, because I noticed your containers. And then there's also, you know, people who having these specific conditions. But so I think I'm excited about about this. Let's, you know, let's go. Let's talk a little bit about what people are going to find on the website. So we've talked about you've given a sort of a

a high level overview of some of the ingredients like amla and I've heard all sorts of things about amla. think as a matter of fact, I think I might have tried it once. It was sort of bitter tasting, but the nutritional panel on amla is just amazing. It's just off the charts. And that's why I tried it because I wanted to mix it in with like my smoothies and drinks like that. But it's just like an amazing superfood. But I do remember it being a little bitter. So if someone

Lolita Sanders (44:44.991)
It is very bitter.

Lolita Sanders (44:54.153)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (45:02.824)
is enjoying this conversation and is having issues, it's, you know, however it came about, whether it's just, you know, it's just happening naturally and they want to see if they can improve the health of their scalp and their hair, or maybe like me, they've been coloring their hair most of their life, or maybe they've been straightening it and curling it, like my wife actually has straightened her hair a few times. She has tremendously beautiful curly hair and she straightens it sometimes and I just, I mean, I love

the way she looks either way, but I always worry about her hair health because of that. And I don't know if I should, but it feels like it would be damaging, but I have no idea. But if people do damage their hair in different ways, this sounds like an amazing product or set of products. If someone has these issues and they love this conversation, where do you want them to start? What is a good place to start with the brand?

Lolita Sanders (46:01.759)
It depends on what the issue is exactly, but a good way of start is to start with our shampoo and our conditioner. Shampoo is sulfate free, paraben free, non-toxic, pH balanced to help with the issues of getting your scalp in order. helps. When I came to find out, when I created Umti, I didn't realize

I had my touch point of what I wanted in the healing effect, where I wanted it to lie for sorting out different issues. But I didn't realize that people with eczema, people with dermatitis, people with dandruff were starting to find relief in the product. People with sensitive skin were now starting to find, because everything is so natural and so mild.

So what I always say to people is if it is sort of a excessive amount of dermatitis or...

hair thinning or hair loss. Start with our shampoo and our conditioner. Even if you are still straightening your hair, it's good. It is basically, it's colour safe. doesn't think it's people that use keratin treatment for the straightening, probably what your wife does to her hair. It's safe for them as well. People with relaxed hair is safe for them. It's having a safer product that helps you even when you are doing the unhealthy habits to our hair.

Ramon Vela (47:15.265)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (47:36.777)
This is literally to help you in that process, having something on a daily basis that is healthier for you. And then once every two months or however long you do your straightening or your coloring, you're doing the, I don't like to call it, it's a personal choice. I mean, I still color my hair, but I now use, I use more natural colorants for my hair. So I use henna and indigo to get the...

Ramon Vela (47:59.905)
Yeah.

Ramon Vela (48:04.556)
Mm, yeah.

Lolita Sanders (48:05.663)
I'm my thing. So the mixture of the two. But it's a process and I'm realized as well because it's a natural color and it takes our whole day to color my hair, literally.

Ramon Vela (48:17.44)
Mm-hmm. Well, and I think people, and I don't mean to say that coloring is bad. I hope I didn't come out that way, but I will say that we have to be as diligent about the products that we use for things like that as we are for pretty much everything else. I mean, if you look at, if you start looking at your scalp the same way that you would look, for instance, at your skin. Like most people now, even myself, like I didn't really, you know, until eight years ago,

Lolita Sanders (48:24.03)
Yeah.

Ramon Vela (48:46.9)
I never really thought about putting lotion on my face or my neck or any other place. I just never thought about it. didn't figure out why do I need it? I never understood the importance of it. when I started doing the show and I started talking to other skincare companies and so forth, I slowly realized a few things. One is, like you said, your skin is the largest organ. so it...

Lolita Sanders (49:00.351)
No.

Ramon Vela (49:16.244)
it will take in, what you put on your skin is really important, you know, and taking care of your skin is really important, especially if you want to, you know, age gracefully and so forth. You, and you want healthy skin, it's really important. So I started putting lotion on, just very basic lotion on my face and my neck and so forth.

But you start to learn all these things and you think, wait a minute, what kind of deodorant am I putting now on my body too? And then, but you know, and I think it's catching up with like in terms of like shampoos and the things that we put on our hair and so forth. I really do feel like more and more people are just aware of all these things that are going on. And I think that's kind of like what, why you're seeing interest in that. And especially, you know, we have all these stresses in our lives. We have stresses from

Lolita Sanders (49:51.315)
that I'm putting on this.

Ramon Vela (50:02.184)
medical conditions that we are experiencing. We have stresses just overall life. We have stresses from just the pollution in the air and so forth. I mean, there's a lot of stuff that we have to stress out about politics and geopolitical wars and everything else. All these things take a toll on our nervous system and our bodies and so forth. So I think it's really important to use products like yours to counterbalance those things and be as healthy as we can.

Lolita Sanders (50:17.255)
no, tell me about it.

Ramon Vela (50:31.852)
I'm really impressed here because I'm looking at the conditioner, the Umti Restorative Conditioner, and you've got Beauty Award for 2025, you've got Beauty Awards for 2024, you've got the Hair Award from 2022, you've got the Marie Claire Hair Award for 2022. So you've definitely got people noticing your hair products. So that's fantastic.

Lolita Sanders (50:56.763)
Yeah, no, it was great. Just a touch back on some of the points that you were saying about, you know, the daily stresses and stuff. When also I am, I'm a certified aromatherapist and a formulator as well. So I formulated these for myself and in our scent as well that we use is an aromatherapy blend that's uplifting.

So we wanted a little bit of a chemotherapy help every step of the way, just little nuggets to help you along the way to deal with the stresses of life, to deal with the anxiety, depressions and things like that. So all our products, even up to the, because I wanted, as I was saying, I was spilling, I was taking out all the bad and filling up with the good. But I also went into...

what is a scent? Is a scent just for, it smells nice? Or do I want something that, it smells nice, but emotionally it's also helping me? So we snuck in the aromatherapy, but into our scent as our scent basis as well. So not only is it good for our skin and our hair, the essential oils that we use, but it's also good for us on a sort of aromatherapy point of view.

Ramon Vela (51:57.324)
Hmm.

Ramon Vela (52:04.108)
Wow.

Ramon Vela (52:16.709)
I love that. And walk us through some of the other stuff people are going to find because you have leave-in cream, have restorative hair oil, you've got hair and body butter, nourishing face cream, you've got soothing face oil, and then you have a few other things here. Walk us through what else do you want people to know?

Lolita Sanders (52:39.177)
Okay, I'm going to walk you through. So for somebody who has or just wants a healthy product for themselves, I would always go with the shampoo and conditioner because it's layered beautifully on top of each other. A shampoo is designed to get rid of dirt, oils and everything off your scalp. A conditioner is designed to sort of attract to the hair strand to fortify it and basically gives it that moisture and nourishment and stuff that it needs.

Ramon Vela (53:06.349)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (53:07.539)
For the leave-in cream, so that would be the basis, the shampoo and the conditioner, that's for everyone. If you have curly hair, I would go for the leave-in conditioner. Because the leave-in conditioner is multi-purpose in use, you can use it as a leave-in conditioner, as a curl activator, detangler, and as a daily hair moisturizer. So that is actually one of our hero products that everybody...

because people use it on a daily basis on their children, on themselves, and even people with locs, because I have many of my clients, had either has locs or sister locs. So it's also loc friendly because it is, it doesn't cause any buildup, but it gives you those nourishment that you need in your hair. It's light enough to use by itself without causing heaviness.

Then the hair oil is all about the hair oil you can use. that hair oil, I'm discovering things with that hair oil that I didn't realize for myself. That hair oil is so full, I call it the multi-vitamin of oils. It's got from, it's seven different oils in there. So you've got your Black Seed, your Casio, your Andorroba, Avocado, Apricot, Cone, Alhoba, Olive Oil, steeped in Amla, Fenugreek and Punjabi, absorb those properties. It's also got some peppermint.

So the hair oil you can use as a scalp massage for the inflammation on your scalp. You can use it as a treatment on your hair pre-poo. So basically putting some hair oil in, putting a shower cap, leaving it there to mellow and then wash your hair out. Or you can just use it after blow drying in your hair to get that shine and bounce back into the hair and sort of to de-frizz. It is fantastic for, I've used it on pimples and stuff. I'm treating my...

Ramon Vela (55:02.306)
Mm-hmm.

Thank

Lolita Sanders (55:05.947)
My teenager who's got acne, so because of the anti-inflammatory oils that are in there, it sort of calms and basically dries out the pimples. I use it whenever I have a sciatica flare, I use it as a pain relief. People use it on their beard, some people use it, love to it on their skin as a bath oil. It's most of our products are really multi-functional.

Ramon Vela (55:08.535)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (55:34.347)
use that you can use especially the leaving cream, the hair oil and then of course the hair and body butter. I use it all over my skin as a moisturizer and I use it in my hair. It is fantastic as well as an after sun care which I've come to discover.

Ramon Vela (55:50.399)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (55:54.335)
So I'm discovering the, as I call it, the magic of umti myself as the formulator, because I formulated for this. And then people come to me, you know what? I tried it for this and it's helping for this. The hair oil was also used by lady trying to, there was a breakout of childhood lice in the hair. And she used that and it was a fantastic treatment for it. Gone and basically a natural way of treating it. As I'm saying, as my...

Ramon Vela (55:59.341)
Hmm.

Ramon Vela (56:14.775)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (56:18.518)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (56:23.901)
As I'm using it and people are using it more, we're discovering there's the endless possibility, I won't say endless, there's so many other things that you can use it for. So I would say for somebody that has color treated hair, or you've colored your hair, stripped your hair and you've gone blonde, which normally causes that straw-like feeling at the ends, conditioner is perfect to sort that out.

leave the conditioner in as a deep conditioner. Leave it on for, I would say, 20 minutes at most, 10 to 20 minutes, and then wash your hair out, and literally you will have wavy, lovely soft hair. The face cream that you've mentioned is due to... I launched that this year and was with... I didn't know how to launch it on its own.

Ramon Vela (57:01.121)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (57:07.266)
Hmm.

Lolita Sanders (57:21.981)
because I've been growing this hair brand for so long and I wanted it to sit by itself, but I just thought, you know what, it's umti, it's a tree, we've got many branches in a tree, maybe this is something. And that is due to people asking me what I was using on my skin. And that the face cream I designed probably about seven or eight years ago for myself.

when I was starting my perimenopausal sort of changes that I was finding in my skin. So I designed that and at the time I think I was using kills or something and I realized that I was making a better product than what I was basically using. So, and yeah, so that was by request from my clients going, share, share what you use in your skin. And that's why those other two products that came about the

Ramon Vela (57:57.165)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (58:20.617)
the face cream and the body care that's also being launched. It does say on our website, it's out of stock. It's been launched next month. So the face cream is literally, it's got from blueberry seed all in there to sparkling wine extract because every girl needs a little bit of bubbles in our lives. So yeah. And so the other products that aren't here was per request of

my clients and just listening to my community what they wanted because they started to realize that their skin care, I guess as you were saying, you you started with one concern and then you start realizing, I need to move on to as in your case, you started with your putting moisturizer on your face and then, I need to think about what's in my shampoo. Next, what are we eating? What are, you know.

Ramon Vela (59:15.149)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (59:15.577)
cycle goes because you then start realizing I'm on hot but I'm getting my toxins from yeah

Ramon Vela (59:21.194)
Yeah. You know, one of the things I love about, you know, what you have, the way you set up the website too, is that, like I clicked on the face screen for instance, and you have the benefits there, and talks about, you know, deep hydration, anti-aging properties, calming formula, et cetera. Then you also have the key ingredients that are in there, which is great. You also have reviews and you also have some verbiage around what it is and so forth.

So you've got a lot of really great information there for people. So I guess at this point, where does someone go? Is it the website the best place to go? Are you in marketplaces or any other place that you want people to go and check out your products?

Lolita Sanders (01:00:07.007)
At moment we e-commerce only, so we are just on our website. And of course there's links through from our socials onto there, which our socials is umtibeauty. And with, I mean, we are still hoping for that one door to open to get into retail, but we are in talks, but as you know, it takes such a long time. But yeah, we just need that one door to open.

Ramon Vela (01:00:32.93)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (01:00:36.447)
for us to go into retail and to align ourselves with a partner that can see our vision and where we want to go and grow as a brand.

Ramon Vela (01:00:46.508)
Well, and I will say also, so there's lots of really great products here. So I highly recommend people going to the website, which is, let me just bring it up here. It is umt.co.uk. Now umt is spelled U-M-T-H-I dot C-O dot U-K. Umt is the H is silent. So it's umt, but it's U-M-T-H-I.

is the website. So this has been amazing. I've just this conversation has been fantastic. I love your reason your your your North Star, why you're doing what you're doing, and why it's important to you why you're so proud of it and why your friends so proud of it. And, and so there's a lot to love about the brand. And I love you know, you broke it when you were talking about customers, you broke down to various

Lolita Sanders (01:01:38.751)
Thank you.

Ramon Vela (01:01:44.912)
various groups, but I just feel like bottom line, if you just want something that's organic, that's sustainable, that's good for you, that's good for the earth. But also if you're dealing with menopause or some of these other skin issues or hair issues, this is a great product to try and to see if it helps you. Like what's not to love about some of the things you're doing here. And I really love the packaging you're using.

Lolita Sanders (01:02:13.823)
Thank you.

Ramon Vela (01:02:14.647)
And I do, I just want to make, you know, I want to make people aware that, that using the aluminum, the recycled aluminum, it is a little bit like it's cheaper probably for you to use plastic. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Lolita Sanders (01:02:28.271)
completely so much cheaper for me. And plastic would have given me less issues than what I have with the packaging. But I was very adamant when we were packaging that the packaging had to be according to our mission, it had to be sustainable, have to basically bring down our carbon footprint. Even though when you do produce aluminium for the first time, the CO2 is quite hectic. because

Ramon Vela (01:02:34.893)
Yeah. Well.

Lolita Sanders (01:02:54.809)
It can, because this continues, it's forever recycled. You can recycle aluminium over and over without having to add new aluminium to it. And that's the reasons why we went with aluminium and we only use aluminium and glass in our products.

Ramon Vela (01:03:11.599)
Well, and I just wanted to make sure we pointed that out because for the audience to know that this is like something extra that you do, like if you, you know, if this is an extra cost for you. And so you're going a bit above and beyond the call of duty there because you know, most manufacturing, most businesses, I mean, they have to stay afloat and they have to, you know, watch their margins and they've got to make profit, be profitable.

And most manufacturing, case most people don't know this, is it's all designed to be as low cost per unit as possible. And that's how people make. And so when you do things sometimes a little outside of that, which is like using aluminum versus plastic, I'm sure your manufacturer is telling you like, hey, you could, or your bottler, whoever your packers, hey, you use plastic, it's a lot cheaper. But I want to point out that

Lolita Sanders (01:03:50.525)
Yes, definitely.

Ramon Vela (01:04:10.081)
when you make the conscious choice to do that because you feel strongly about your company values, that it's extra. And people should know that. And so, I think it's admirable too.

Lolita Sanders (01:04:20.095)
Even our ingredients, we just go for premium ingredients. There's so many different grading of the ingredients, but we go for the real premium, the organic ones. So we're paying a heftier price for it. But I don't want to lose that. I don't want to lose that integrity of the brand where it's all basically by... I guess it's like we both can cook...

I should be cooling. We both can cook the same meal but if we use different ingredients the same meal will taste differently. So if you use a better grade quality of steak to your normal steak there's a difference. You pay a premium price of course for the better quality and that's where most of basically our cost comes is because

Ramon Vela (01:04:52.131)
Amen.

Ramon Vela (01:05:00.932)
Mm-hmm.

Ramon Vela (01:05:07.801)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (01:05:17.331)
We go for the premium, we go for the best of the best because if you start off with really, really good ingredients, the rest sorts itself out.

Ramon Vela (01:05:25.423)
Yeah, well, I mean, and I think that goes back to what you're saying earlier on about integrity and wanting to have a brand that had that integrity. And people should know that this sometimes costs a little extra, but the ingredients, you can build that trust with the audience and the audience knows that you're building the best product that you possibly can, as well as...

working within the parameters of your values around sustainability and organic and everything else. So I think you meet our tagline, which is products we're buying, brands we're supporting, because I love your story. I love your products. I love why you do what you do. And I just feel like people will want to support you as well.

This so thank you so much for for being on the show and I want to be respect for your time. So if there's any last words you want to leave with the audience, anything last that you want to make sure they they know about the brand or about you.

Lolita Sanders (01:06:22.623)
I think I've said so much. I'm normally quite a shy person. no, firstly, the brand is for everyone that basically just want something better. That's what the brand is for, for everyone. It's Umti is dedicated to bringing the healing power of nature into every bottle.

Ramon Vela (01:06:25.359)
I put you on the spot.

Ramon Vela (01:06:43.705)
Mm-hmm.

Lolita Sanders (01:06:52.767)
And that's basically our mission, our first mission statement. So it's for everyone, even if you're not having hair concerns, but just wants really good quality products for your hair and for your hair to thrive. Yeah, we are the brand to go for. And also if you are ticking or you are on your sustainability growth, we are the brand to go for.

You are just looking for brand that you can trust. And I hope that comes across. So what we're trying is to be basically to serve with trust and integrity in the space. So, yes, and maybe try something new if you never know. And if you are in your menopausal, my son is going through puberty. So I wanted the stuff to be good for him while his hormones are changing.

and also good for me while my hormones are declining, where he's going up, mine are going down. And I wanted something that basically can serve us both in that effect. As I said, the brand, it initially started with me, but it grew into something bigger where I wanted it to sort of land for my nine-year-old to 40-year-old and to me going through my menopausal stages and stuff and having something that can.

Ramon Vela (01:07:51.385)
He

Lolita Sanders (01:08:17.555)
help us along our way to sort of live naturally and be our authentic selves.

Ramon Vela (01:08:23.617)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, I love it. I love it.

Lolita Sanders (01:08:26.757)
without having to worry about basically doing harm along the way.

Ramon Vela (01:08:31.181)
Yeah, no, and I think, like I said, I think more and more people want those attributes in their products and in their lives as well. So I can appreciate that. So this has been amazing. I truly appreciate your time. I know it's already past dinnertime, so your family is waiting for you, I'm sure, to enjoy your meal. But thank you so much for sharing about your brand, about your product, about your life. There's so much.

An hour is a good time to get a good overview, but I feel like there's certain areas that we could have been talking for hours about different parts of your life that I wish we could elaborate even further. But know that you're always welcome back. So whenever you have another product launch, you have a new... That was actually one thing I was gonna ask you, like if there's any new products coming or form factors, because I can really see you creating supplements for your hair because...

You mentioned it briefly where you said something like it's, it's, know, what you, what you eat also, you know, has an effect on your hair and your health and everything else. And that's a hundred percent true. so I, when I was looking at your product line, I was thinking like, well, I can, I can probably see like some supplements here too. who knows? I'm putting ideas in your head. but this has been great. So, so thank you so much again.

Lolita Sanders (01:09:34.345)
Okay.

Lolita Sanders (01:09:48.51)
You never know.

Lolita Sanders (01:09:57.222)
No, I need to thank you for creating the space for brands like mine to just share their stories that we don't normally. We can't sort of the storytelling on socials and our website doesn't land as well. And for you to create this space, I'm really grateful. And thank you for having me. I can't believe that you chose us to basically come on in.

I'm really grateful for that. I'm grateful to be seen.

Ramon Vela (01:10:27.077)
no, it's my honor. It's really my honor. So everyone out there, we have just had Lolita Sanders, who is the founder of UMT. In UMT is spelled U-M-T-H-I. And then the UMT, the H is silent. It's U-M-T-H-I dot C-O dot U-K is a website. I'm going to have that website as well as the social media account.

Lolita Sanders (01:10:31.999)
Thank

Ramon Vela (01:10:55.947)
On our podcast description, which you could find on Apple, on Spotify, and pretty much anywhere you listen to podcasts, simply type in the story of our brand show and you should be able to find it. I always recommend people go to Apple or Spotify, that's our main channels. And if you're there, please leave a rating review. It really helps me get more listeners and helps me get more sponsors and it's just helpful overall. So go leave a rating review. Beyond that everyone, I always say stay safe, stay sane, stay healthy. And in this case, one way of doing that,

is going to umt.co.uk and checking out what the brand is all about. We talked a lot about the health of your hair and the damage that can take place. And just if you want healthier hair and you want to be sustainable and you want something good for you, good for the earth, then go check it out. And I think in this case, you should be thinking about the health of your scalp, the health of your hair. We've talked all about that. So go check it out.

Probably best thing to do by the way is go to the website sign up for their newsletter and that way you get you You will know about all the new products and all the promotions and events or whatever it's going on And you'll find out first about all of that beyond that everyone one last thing We've all been going through a lot of stuff the pandemic and then the economy and geopolitical wars and Politics and everything going on in this country and in other places

It could be very stressful and it could be having this whole on people. Some people get laid off. Some people are just unhappy. Some people are just filled with anxiety. Let's just do ourselves a favor and remember that everyone is going through something. And if we can just be a little kinder to each other, I know we can make this human experience a better one. Beyond that, thank you from the bottom of my heart for listening to another episode of the story of a brand.