Rodan + Fields - Transformation from the Inside Out: Building a Modern Omni-Channel Powerhouse

Rose (00:03.714)
Hello everyone and welcome to the story of a brand. I'm Rose Hamilton, CEO of Compass Rose Ventures and your host for today. And today we're really in for a treat. I am so excited. We are joined by someone who knows what it takes to lead transformation inside iconic brands. Ancy Rowe, Chief Commercial Officer at Rodan and Fields is with us today.

Ansi's career spans from some of the biggest names in beauty, including L'Oreal, Maybelline, Garnier, Lancome, and IT Cosmetics, where she helped shape global storytelling for brands people absolutely love. Now, she's leading Rodin and Fields through one of the most ambitious pivots in beauty, evolving from a billion dollar direct selling company to a modern omni-channel powerhouse with retail, affiliate, and DTC integration.

So today we're going to explore how she's blending legacy and reinvention and what it really takes to architect brand transformation from the inside out. Welcome, Ansi. We are so excited to have you here today.

Anncy Rowe (01:06.687)
Thank you so much, Rose, and what an introduction. Thank you for having me.

Rose (01:10.892)
Well, before we get started on the brand story, which is going to be a very cool conversation, I'd love to start with yours. I mean, you've led some of the most respected names in beauty. And I guess I'd love to know, and for the listeners, what drew you from those global powerhouses at L'Oreal and Lancome to Rodan and Fields, a brand that's in clearly a reinvention mode. I can't wait to hear.

Anncy Rowe (01:34.452)
Absolutely. So, you know, it's so interesting because growing up, I never really thought about beauty, to be honest. It wasn't like I was a heavy makeup user or a skincare user. Even as I got into marketing, I was working at consumer goods and I kind of stumbled upon beauty by accident. I had a friend that went to go work at Avon and so I was like, oh, beauty.

followed her right along for the journey. And so went to Avon working in global marketing. I absolutely loved it. I'll tell you working on other brands, like I've worked in the what I consider not so exciting space of oral care. like dental floss, toothbrushes, rose, which is all very important, but not not as exciting as beauty. So I kind of stumbled into beauty because of a friend and I

thrived there, Rose. I think what I love about beauty is that you have to look backwards a bit to understand what went wrong or what went right.

but you don't ever get stuck there. In fact, you have to keep evolving. You have to keep looking towards the future. You have to anticipate trends. And so I loved that piece. I loved that it was a mix of left brain and right brain, both creative as well as analytical and such a high passion category, right? Seeing, you know, women shop at the shelf on my brands has always been one of my most favorite things to do, just like,

be in the stores and see how they're shopping, how they make decisions, how much they read the packaging. It is not just about the promotions, it's every part of it. So I really fell in love with Beauty and I was at Avon in 2007, so it's been such a long time. And so then to your question.

Anncy Rowe (03:33.178)
went to L'Oreal and I honestly never thought that I would have been at L'Oreal either, but I went into interview and loved everyone that I met. I joined L'Oreal on the Maybelline team and to your point worked on these amazing brands that had so much cachet, so much brand history, so much consumer love. And Rose, I wanted to take everything that I learned working on those businesses.

and take it to Rodan and Fields and say, how do I bring this brand building to a brand that quite honestly has a very strong cult following, but only 30 % awareness. So so much opportunity to drive the brand, bring it to the masses. And when I think about my history, I've only worked on those established brands, brands that kind of, Rose, when I say Longcomb, you know.

Something, there's something in your head about Lancome or Maybelline. Rodan and Fields, you might not know. And so I loved the opportunity to be able to shape what it means in the minds of consumers. And to your point, lead it during a huge pivot in its go-to-market model, which is something that a lot of brand leaders don't have the opportunity to do. So it was an exciting opportunity.

Rose (04:53.72)
Well, and you've clearly led through great storytelling. And when you and I were talking, you mentioned some of these legacy brands had beautiful stories, but they'd already been told. Now at Rodan and Fields, it gives you that chance to craft a brand new one. So what is the process teaching you about building story from scratch versus evolving an existing narrative? What does that look like?

Anncy Rowe (05:19.72)
So I love that question, Rose. You know, one of the things that I said to my team and the leadership team at Rodan and Fields when I started is that I never want to be that business person that comes on, that marketer, that storyteller that just takes a brand from having a unique place in the market.

to vanilla. And we've seen it time and time again, as brands grow or new leadership comes on, it kind of loses a little bit along the way every time. Every time there's a brand restage or a refresh or you see it, sometimes the brand loses its magic. And so for me,

my process, which was literally a year ago, I came in and tried to learn everything I could about the brand. Right? There was a reason why this brand has been around for 15 plus years and has consumers that have been loyal to it for, you know, for a decade. So I didn't want to lose that. I wanted to make sure that I was really understanding what makes this brand set apart and

I promised my leadership team I would make sure to stay very true to that DNA, but actually tell that story. And so for me, was what it was. Rosa was talking to the founders, talking to Dr. Kathy Fields. She blew my mind with some of the stories that she told me about the brand.

And I wanted to tell that story to everyone. I wanted to make sure that consumers knew exactly what that story is and how we could tell it in a way that was modern, relevant to consumers today.

Rose (07:05.805)
it's such a remarkable opportunity. And if you think about it, legacy brands really manage meaning. Challenger brands create it, but you get the opportunity to do the blend of both. And that creation really requires a level of, I'd say, bravery that can only come from experience, which is what I think makes you unique. And if you also think about it, true transformation isn't just rebranding. And a lot of what you're talking about is re-engineering about how

a business creates belief. And I think the best leaders know you don't just change what people see about your brand, you change their experience at every single touch point. And that's really where growth compounds. So what sparked this transformation for Rodan and Fields? And what did it take to evolve or what is it taking to evolve a consultant led brand into a true omni-channel

Anncy Rowe (07:38.036)
Right.

Anncy Rowe (08:01.288)
So as I mentioned before, the brand has been around and has that cult following, has about 30 % awareness. And so as the brand continued to evolve over the years, and you're right, started with direct selling brand consultants telling the story. And Rose, honestly, that was very cornerstone to the DNA of the brand. our two founders, Dr. Kathy Rodan and Kathy Fields, they believed that the

biggest truth tellers we could get are women talking about the transformation that the products deliver on skin. And so it would be me and you Rose at our kitchen tables or at a coffee shop going through the products, talking about the products, feeling the formulas, talking about the transformation and the science. so.

Those beauty consultants were our everything and are still a critical part of our business. So we have 70,000 plus beauty consultants still with Rodan and Fields today. However, what I love about the brand and really the leadership of the brand is that we wanted to make sure just like our products deliver, we want to make sure our go-to market is also delivering for what women need. You know, I didn't talk about the brand story, Rose, but you know, the

Rose (09:18.072)
Please do.

Anncy Rowe (09:19.028)
I would love to. And of course, like what a fitting place to tell the story on your podcast. But the brand actually started, you know, 15 plus years ago, as I said, but it was because Drs. Katie and Kathy were early. They met at Stanford, first of all, in the 90s, which rose. I mean, amazing, accomplished dermatologists. And there are not there were not a lot of women dermatologists then.

There are not even enough today, but we have made so much progress. And so they were really in this male dominated dermatology field. And as they started practicing, they felt there were not enough real solutions for women, real transformative results that understood.

the skin of women, the problems, the issues, the challenges that we face as we go through the life stages, whether you are in your twenties and stressed out from your first job and you're dealing with adult acne to post pregnancy, melasma to maybe extreme dry skin through perimenopause, they really knew all of the facets of what women's skin go through. And when they looked at, first of all, the patients they were treating, but also the offerings that were out in the market.

they felt like nothing was delivering exactly what women needed. And so they developed this approach, which was, they call it multi-med therapy, but it's exactly the right ingredients within the right formulations in the right order. No more, no less. Rose, you don't need to have a 20 step process if you don't need a 20 step process. And so really tried to simplify skincare and address each of the life stages of women. Now I say all of that to say,

As we think about this brand, we are actually the number one female dermatologist founded skincare brand. And to me, opportunity, it's a huge deal, but it's also sad when you think about the clinical space within Derm.

Rose (11:10.735)
Deal

Rose (11:20.216)
Yeah.

Anncy Rowe (11:20.252)
It's male dominated, just like when doctors Katie and Kathy started, there were not enough women founders that could take the leap and say, you know what? I can develop for women. I know women's skin. I have breakthrough ingredients. We have our own labs in Berkeley, California, develop our own products, clinically test everything. And so I love that we are the number one female founded, but so much more opportunity for growth, I would say in this space. And so if we fast forward to

Rose (11:45.57)
Yes.

Anncy Rowe (11:49.32)
going from this direct selling beauty consultant led business, we want to make sure that we were being true to what women needed. And part of that is being where she shops. So we know there are some women Rose that need the expertise. Like, you know what, I'm dealing with adult acne. I don't know what the heck is going on. I need someone to help me. And so if her friend has amazing skin and she's got great products hearing from her or

If she wants to touch and feel at Ulta, she can do that because we are also distributed at Ulta and that just happened this year, which was something landmark for the brand. And last year we also went direct to consumer. So if you are like, you know what, I can really shop for myself. I'm really ingredient savvy. I can take all the tools and quizzes that Rodan and fields has on their website and decipher for myself. I can buy direct to consumer on rodanandfields.com.

So now we are omni-channel and to me, I can't quote this, but I think we are one of the few truly omni-channel brands in that respect where you could buy us brick and mortar, you can buy us online or you can buy us through your beauty consultant.

Rose (13:03.514)
That's incredible. And there's something really important in this heritage that I feel like you've carried forward. You know, I think about an example would be for me, the vitamin shop and the health enthusiasts and how important hiring people who have the nutritional background, have some sort of a background and building, building that team who lives in the stores to be able to advise in a unique specialty way.

And it seems like the consultant led piece has a lot of human elements that no AI bot is going to change. It's very personalized. And you're also personalizing, letting people make choices wherever they want, wherever they are, you're meeting them across the touch points. And so it sounds like there's a lot that you're learning about maintaining trust and legacy while modernizing this brand. And it's almost

Anncy Rowe (13:40.084)
Right.

Rose (14:01.226)
It almost sounds to me like it's about the alignment with the consumer and meeting them where they are versus forcing a new model or changing something rapidly. Like you're bringing forward the heritage, but then you're layering on the new mediums that are really required to meet that new consumer.

Anncy Rowe (14:18.846)
That's right. That's exactly right, Rosa. When you think about it, because unlike a small brand that was just starting.

A lot of this case study wouldn't be true, right? Like you asked me, what would you do? You know, how do you make sure you maintain the storytelling or how do you bring the brand to life that you can? You almost have to craft on a small brand. This brand is actually hundreds of millions of dollars. And so how do we make sure we maintain our current consumer who loves us, who loves that we have that high touch channel? But also, to your point, we bring in new consumers, which

Honestly, Rose, when you look at skincare, a lot of us think we are our own dermatologist. We are, we are buying all the products, right? Buying all the ingredients, layering together. You see, you know, different influences telling you what you should be using. And so we also want to be there to cater to her. I recently heard this

similarity of Rodan and Fields was like the original influencer, which I thought was so interesting. It's true because we had our beauty consultants. And so I would say we are evolving our influence from the beauty consultants, but also we are activating with influencers and we are trying to be with her through all her sources of influence, whether that is one-to-one or whether it is through social media, whoever that might be.

Rose (15:27.138)
That's the reason.

Rose (15:49.826)
There's something really precious that you talked about around the founder DNA, and I would call it the brand soul. So when a brand is built by women, for women, who challenge the status quo, that DNA seems to me like it becomes a incredible competitive advantage. I mean, the world doesn't need just another skincare company. There's plenty of them out there. It needs brands with conviction. And you're talking a lot about conviction.

So when you root the business and purpose and principle, you earn something far deeper than sales. you're earning trust to maintain that customer through all the parts in the journey. So I'm super curious. How does Rodan and fields female founded legacy show up and how you lead and communicate and build messages that resonate today.

Anncy Rowe (16:41.544)
That's right. That's such a great question. And honestly, that's music to my ears. This point of leading with conviction to that point. Like, again, like I said, my worst fear was coming into a brand, any brand, this brand, any of my past brands and. Vanilla fighting it because you're just starting to lose the beauty and the jewel of that brand. So I fully agree with you for us.

Again, starting with what does the brand stand for? And Rose, beauty of this brand is that, you know, we are a well-oiled machine because we are an established brand, but I got to do the things that an indie brand would get to take advantage of if they were starting, meaning let's put on a paper.

What is our brand positioning? What is our manifesto? What do we want to be? And we've shared that with everyone that we can. And our goal, that's our North Star. So to your point, how do we maintain that? Number one, female dermatologist founded skincare brand.

is on everything. Like that is super important to us. You will find it on our website, which is our, that's our flagship store. You will find it on our product detail pages. You'll find it in our press releases. We are telling editors, influencers, you Rose, that story. And every time we tell it, people are like, really? So when we started telling the story, which really happened May this year with a full campaign that I'll talk to you about.

our search results went like this, like from zero to a hundred. And you look at us versus some of the top 10 skincare brands that I'm competing with, we've trumped them because people are like, what is this brand? How could they be number one? And I haven't heard of them. And so being very true to that North Star is important.

Anncy Rowe (18:39.56)
For us, we've also brought in an advisory board of trailblazing female germs in the space. we have three amazing germs we're working with. And if you think of what I talked about, we're a brand that's across all the life stages. And so we have a female dermatologist based in New York who's amazing, who's an acne expert. So adults, teen, everything, she is our go-to. We have another female dermatologist who has an expertise in women of color.

and discolorations, which is a need state for women of color. She's based in San Francisco. And then we have another dermatologist who is trailblazing in the technology space and actually leverages AI within her derm practice. And so she helps us to keep on the forefront of how to unleash technology within the brand. And so we brought this derm panel on. We thought about our founders and how do we keep their storytelling alive, their

how they were really fearless in starting the brand. How do we keep that alive with this board of our germ panel? And they help us with innovation. So as they are hearing from their patients about what's top of mind for women today, we are bringing back those insights to innovate on. Like Rose, Ozempic face wasn't around in the 90s, right? It wasn't around in the 2000s. There are new need states.

Rose (20:04.814)
No.

Anncy Rowe (20:08.722)
that are happening that we want to make sure that we are formulating for. And a lot of brands will probably say this, but we formulate with a lot of purpose to your point about having conviction. We're not one of the brands that launch five launches a year. We don't do it because our founders have been known to stop, halt everything if we're not achieving our clinical results. So we

are very choiceful about how we're formulating, what we're formulating for, and the bar that we hold ourselves to, because we are developing all these things ourselves. And so anyway, it is, I am saying that because it is critical that we keep that conviction, as you said, and bring that through the, to me, it's what our founders brought to the table and what the story is, is that we are the highest quality, the quite highest efficacy.

and you are going to see results and love what you see when you use our products. That is our legacy. So Rose, that's the campaign that we actually launched earlier this year. We wanted to share that story with everyone and so earlier this year we launched the full 360 campaign, our first ever because we've always been

ANSI and Rose at the kitchen table. We've never invested in media, never invested in social storytelling, never invested in influencer because it's been our beauty consultants that have told the story. And so this was the first year and we will continue to invest in the brand. And we launched a full 360 campaign called Love What You See. And it's all based on the testimonials of

how we have transformed women's skin over the years and what those true verbatims are, bringing those to life. I remember one of my favorite verbatims is, she asked me if I've had work done. Like these are real stories, like, you know, I'm using our products. So we wanted to tell those stories. So love what you see launched earlier this year. And again, it's how we're keeping our founder story alive.

Rose (22:20.044)
Well, and what that speaks to is that purpose-led brands are going to outlast those trend-led categories with constant launches without taking the time to look back and making sure that it connects into the purpose. And it also leads me to wonder, with all that success, we know the female-founded brands are so important. And as you look at the category and you look at the top 10,

What do you think is the biggest barrier for keeping female founded brands in that top 10? What makes it so hard to break that?

Anncy Rowe (23:01.842)
I do believe that we are going to break that. What I think the issue has been is that female founded brands are late to the party. So when you look at the top 10, are a lot are established brands that have been around for decades and

have now the backing of major conglomerates. So they are part of the big strategics, if you will. I do believe Lordan and Fields can be in the top 10, 100%. I think especially now with this transformation that we're undergoing and continuing to invest and bring that awareness to brands, bring the awareness of the brand to more people. I also think, you know, in this day and age, and, you know, I know we're all thinking about the economy each and every day.

We're a premium player. You know, when I think of the top 10, I'm thinking about premium skincare within this premium skincare space. Rodan and feels is, is, is with a select few. The founders launched saying we want to be a clinical luxury player in some people's minds that might be an oxymoron.

because you're either luxury where maybe it's a lot of beautiful textures and storytelling, but maybe not hardcore efficacy and clinical trials behind it. Then you might have clinical players where a lot of hardcore efficacy before and afters, clinical claims, but maybe the products are not the best to use. They don't feel that great.

This is the marriage of both of those things. It is clinical and it is luxury. And when you try it, the products feel amazing, but they're delivering results. So why I brought up the economy is because I think in this day and age where all of us are looking at our wallets and getting more and more apprehensive about the things we invest in, people are looking for results.

Anncy Rowe (25:02.098)
deliver results, they're looking for not just magic storytelling, magic creams, they're looking for results that they can see. And so for me, I do believe we can get into the top 10. I have a conviction about that. And when I look at the top 10 to me, that is the anomaly. There hasn't been a lot of female founders in the space. There hasn't been a lot of support from...

communities that invest in brands, especially female founded brands. So I think it's like it's this next chapter, I believe we will see a lot more of that and a lot more movement and I hope especially for my brand.

Rose (25:44.118)
Well, and the thing that strikes me here is that while you're an iconic brand, you now get the opportunity to be a challenger brand, to disrupt those that are so entrenched. So it's like you get to take forward the history, but the way you're thinking about it from an omnichannel perspective and staying true to the brand purpose enables you, with the investments, to become the challenger brand.

And it also strikes me that brand awareness used to be about reach, right? Now it's about resonance, which you have in spades. So you can buy impressions, but you cannot buy belief, which is what Rodan and Fields has. So the brands that are going to win are the ones that tell the stories people feel. They don't just scroll past. And so I love what you're talking about, about the blend of iconic storytelling, history, plus challenger. So.

One thing you mentioned is that only 30 % of consumers know Rodan and Fields. So that's an important insight. So how are you thinking about reintroducing the brand to this modern audience? You've talked certainly about DTC being new, thinking through 360 campaigns. What can you tell us that's working the best to connect the legacy side and to support those who've supported the brand?

but also finding these new consumers. What's working within that space?

Anncy Rowe (27:13.364)
Mm-hmm.

Rose, it hasn't been easy. would say especially because there's no playbook here for our brand. What we've had to do is really hone in on who is our consumer. And Rose, we've named them. Lisa is our existing consumer. Marissa is our new consumer that's coming in. And the beauty...

of both of them is that actually they have a huge overlap. There's a lot of synergy between the two. Lisa, our existing consumer, she is again like proof is in the pudding. She's not going to necessarily believe that in social media and that everything that she sees in social is going to make her buy. No, she actually wants to see the proof. She's going to read all the reviews. She's going to hear from her beauty consultant on what if it works, if it doesn't work. so

Lisa is a high, high spender in skincare, but she wants to see the results. She wants to look at the clinical trials, all of that. Marissa, on the other hand, she is influenced by social media. She is influenced by influencers. She wants to know what's buzzing because she believes there is a reason why it's buzzing. TikTok is obviously a strong influence. And so to your point, how do we...

attract those two, maintain Lisa and attract Marissa. For us, it's been really honing in on what's the commonality between the two and then making sure that we are going after that consumer. So it's been so interesting to dive deeper into the consumer because they actually both, there are a few key things.

Anncy Rowe (28:54.834)
They believe health is wealth. So really believe in health and wellness, taking care of yourself, whether you're in your forties or in your thirties, like this idea that health is wealth, longevity, that piece, which is so hot. There is that commonality between the two. They love family and friends spending time. They love traveling. They, they are goal getters. We've said both Lisa, even if she's more established in her career or Marissa coming up, like they are both

goal getters, so really like driven women, and they both believe in derm developed skincare, high quality and ingredients. So I paint that picture of the consumer rose because for us, as we built our 360 plan, we wanted to be really choiceful about what we do. It is, I'm not at one of my old brands where I have these huge, you know, $100 million A &P budgets. That's not the case anymore. And so,

It's being very choiceful and testing and learning as we're going into this space to see what resonates. And so we've learned a lot as we went in earlier this year, it was so, it was so exciting to see Rose and I guess, I guess different than my past in that every lever that I turned on, I could see the results in my past lives. Multiple people had a hand in every lever here.

It's really a select view. So we turned on, we did connected TV earlier this year. The search results through the freaking roof and we attracted Lisa and Marissa. We found that sweet spot for existing consumers. We're like, my God, I just saw Rodan and Fields. I new consumers were searching us. So it was the beauty of that. But I'll say we tested so many different levers, audio, what we're doing with influencers and social. And as we,

We actually do again have some of the more proven things that I would look to implement on bigger brands, which is something like a brand health tracker to just check how are the equity metrics of the brand evolving over time. And one of the things that I loved to see is that two years ago, maybe your beauty consultant was your number one source of awareness. Now.

Anncy Rowe (31:13.648)
it's friends and family and advocacy. So that word of mouth is happening in the marketplace, which Rose, you know, that's huge in skincare, more than an ad being out there, which I love my connected TV and the results we've seen, but more than that being pushed. If Rose can tell me about her new skincare that she tried, that's the Holy grail. And so

It's been a lot of testing and learning, being super clear on who that consumer is and the commonality between the two, and learning what's working as we're going along the way so we can amplify.

Rose (31:50.08)
I love it. love it. There's a connection point in here that you're touching on, which is also about innovation and the combination of innovation and clinical luxury positioning. So I think about innovation as it's not about flooding the market like we talked about with launches, but it's really about releasing something that moves the market forward.

And smart leaders know when to pause, just like you described, when to refine. If it didn't make it through the trials, take it off, protect the brand's equity until the product and the positioning align perfectly. And that's really long game thinking. So when when we're Dan and Fields coined the term clinical luxury, what does innovation mean to you in a world where every brand claims to be clean and clinical now?

and they're not all clean and clinical. know people take, they take advances and are bold with what their claims are. So how do you approach that?

Anncy Rowe (32:57.886)
You know, when I, as we were building that manifesto, if you will, that positioning, the formulation philosophy was really critical to us. And so Rose, we said, you know what, these are three things that we are always going to stand by that we will not shift no matter what. It's our formulation philosophy. One was making sure, as I talked about earlier, the multi-med

therapies that our founders developed. One is that we will make sure that we are always leveraging ingredients to their optimal level versus other brands that I have seen.

just do the max so that they could claim the max amount because consumers think more is better. I think we have the conviction and the belief to say more is not always better. You don't. Sometimes you're ruining your skin barrier if you think more is better. So it's about the optimal ingredient level, I would say. Two is to make sure that we are, as you said, and as I said, we're not chasing trends. We are.

Rose (33:57.176)
Yep.

Anncy Rowe (34:05.106)
developing very specifically for unmet needs in the market in our way of doing it. And if we don't deliver on the results that we need, then we're not launching. And so that was really critical for us to say, if that means that the launch that we have next year doesn't happen, it doesn't happen. I would say, formulation philosophy, the efficacy levels or the ingredient levels, the fact that we are that

Those levels and formulations are showing results in our clinical trials. Every single product we have is clinically tested. Not all brands can say that. And then three, we're not dealing with outside manufacturers. We are formulating ourselves, Rose, within skincare. I'll tell you, that level of innovation.

people are using outside vendors. Other brands are using outside vendors to get that level of innovation required. They're using third parties and we really pride ourselves on having our own labs and formulating ourselves. So that was the North Star from a formulation perspective for us to make sure that we are really staying true to who we are versus on this innovation cycle. Now.

There might, Rose, I'll tell you quite candidly right now in 2027, we've got three launches planned. Those three launches might not maintain and we do it on purpose, right? We're putting all of them, we're seeing how they develop. One is amazing, truly a game changer. All of them are game changers, but one is like something that's really out there. And so we don't know, there's risk in that, right? And so you parallel path and you see what's going to deliver the best results and you go forward.

Rose (35:46.496)
Well, if I were to summarize what you're saying, I think there's a nugget here that the most powerful innovation is actually restraint, like waiting until the brand is ready to carry it versus racing forward just because. it's incredible. like that, thank you for sharing the component on innovation, because I feel like I have a lot of conversations on the innovation front.

And I can look at a pipeline literally of 50 products and think to myself, and where's the testing? And where's the focus? Because you can't possibly have enough marketing dollars to get behind 50. So which are the ones that are going to actually shine through? So I think what you're sharing is pretty revolutionary. And there's another topic here that's around transformation. So transformation is 20 % strategy, 80 % culture.

Anncy Rowe (36:28.308)
Totally.

Rose (36:41.698)
So there's a cultural component here and the playbook means nothing if your people don't believe in it. So real leaders, real brands that are successful turn culture, I think, into a growth system where that clarity you're describing and accountability drive confidence like at every level. So I'm so curious, you've gone through trends, you're going through transformation and you're going through being iconic to now being challenger.

So what cultural shifts have had to happen to support this reinvention at Rodan and Fields? Dying to know.

Anncy Rowe (37:15.444)
So many shifts. And I think this is such a great question, Rose. Honestly, I'm still learning it. What a lesson in leadership to drive a brand through transformation, unlike being already in that leadership position from a brand perspective, established brand. It's been really eye-opening because

The people, the team, the talent is so critical to the success, which is I think what you're touching on. That is the culture, right? And for me, I'll tell you through the interviewing process, we've been building up this A plus team, my all star team, they're all rock stars. in order to recruit the talent and...

set people on this very fast moving path. It's not been easy, right? To lead through transformation is, we're all working hard. But what's helped is knowing what that North Star is, knowing what that purpose is. As I've been interviewing candidates over the past months and building up this team, telling the story, people are like, I wanna be a part of that.

I want to be a part of this transformation. I want to be a part of getting that number one female founded Derm brand into the top 10. And so I would say you've touched on purpose throughout this discussion. And I think it's also critical in how you build the team and the culture, getting people that are as passionate about this idea and the brand DNA as I am. so that's been, it's been amazing to build the team. But then.

to also figure out the processes so people can move fast, right? There's so much gray and muddy as we're just like wading through it. I have some new team members that just joined a couple of months ago and I know they are going through it and they're just trying to get their sea legs, right? For how do I understand this versus my established brand that I came from?

Rose (39:29.592)
Thanks.

Anncy Rowe (39:34.888)
How do I, do I just make the decision and go? Do I have to ask 50,000 people? Who are the people? And so it's been a lot of learning, I would say for me, for my team. But having that purpose, think, for me has been one of the most critical things because that's where you feel inspired.

to go above and beyond. I personally feel inspired to go above and beyond because I know we're doing something that hasn't been done before and we're transforming a brand. So that has been really motivating and exciting for me. Every time we have a win, I think what I need to do is make sure that we're celebrating it, right? Like each of those wins, sometimes we just are on to the next thing.

Rose (40:14.616)
Yes.

Anncy Rowe (40:19.294)
But man, when we see our Amazon search results and our Google search results just skyrocketing, like we just need to take a second to celebrate, because that's all of the collective work of all of us. culture, I think, been, it's been exciting to build, but I'm still building it. We're still building it. We still don't have clarity in terms of roles and responsibilities yet. We will get there. But I've also, as I've gone, been...

myself trying to figure out exactly what is it do I need? And sometimes I'm right and sometimes I wrong. I think I need this. And then it's like, oh no, I didn't actually need that. I need this. And so that's the challenge when we're all new. So we're kind of all learning together. But I think having that North Star has really helped to establish the culture and that winning mindset.

Rose (41:09.73)
That makes a ton of sense. it's almost as though culture is the infrastructure that makes the execution possible. And when you're trying to speed up and you've got so much newness, a lot of the work we do at Compass Rose is around transformational change, which means new people coming in, culture shock of new teams morphing together, and multiple competing priorities sometimes.

So I'm also curious, how do you keep the teams focused, even though there's chaos going on and inspired when the brand is evolving so fast? Because you've got so much happening. Any tips and tricks for those who might be going through transformation like this, because I think it's a really important topic and keeping focused and choosing the critical few seem so important. So how do you keep the team inspired and focused at the same time?

Anncy Rowe (41:39.463)
Right.

Anncy Rowe (42:08.624)
It's not easy. And you know, you're probably asking me at the worst time, Rose, as we're getting into holiday and it is like, well, all hands are in it. My, my advice that I can also do better of is helping the teams to prioritize. I'll tell you, we actually just did it today as a leadership team. said for this one meeting that we have next week, which is all about holiday team, let's just focus on these three things.

versus this week we focused maybe on 10 things and didn't get any of them right. So it's like next week, let's focus on three things. So my advice, one is, know, be in the here and now. think there is, everyone wants to, I'm a very type A. I want to plan for the future. I want to plan for 2027. Sometimes you just have to slow down and take inventory of what needs to be done right now. And then within that even with your teams,

help them to prioritize. What I found is sometimes team members don't want to come to you for help and prioritizing because they feel it might be a sign of weakness. Help to underscore that it's not a sign of weakness. It's just there's a lot going on. so...

trying to build a safe, a space of safety that team members can come to you and be like, hey, I've got these 10 things to do. I can probably only do five. What are the top five? Making sure that you're also creating a space back to culture where team members can come back to you. And I feel like on my end, we are starting to make progress there where there's now a culture, people are starting to know each other.

They're starting to feel safe where they know, I can't do these things and so can come to me and try to ask for guidance on what are those core things that need to be done.

Rose (44:02.958)
Well, that is 100 % true. And I think great leaders are, they're pattern recognizers, just as you're describing. So we spot what scales, we let go of what no longer fits in the moment. And it's like every chapter of your career should teach you a different form of, call it adaptability, resilience, grit, all of those things, because in brand building, flexibility is the real competitive advantage.

So you've led some of beauty's most iconic brands. You're in the challenger space now. So what mindset has carried you from big iconic to this now faster moving space and through this reinvention? I would imagine there's a mindset that you've had to gain and grow that you maybe weren't born with it, but you've had to build it.

Because we all know you've got adaptability is the thing that is the most important part in real competitive advantage. So, know, any pearls tips of wisdom for those who might be faced with similar challenges.

Anncy Rowe (45:09.724)
You know, Rose, am. I feel so blessed to have worked on those big businesses. I learned so much about how to, you know, reinvent brands when there have been legacy brands, how to bring new stories to market for legacy brands. I learned how to do marketing of some of those big iconic brands, and I loved it. I love my experience on all of them. Here.

I think the benefit is that we move fast. So to your point, there is an agility that I have not seen before, which I quite honestly love. And I didn't know if I would love it. I quite honestly love the agility. I think there's a real understanding of speed over perfection that, yeah, speed over, which that took as a type A, that took a long time for me to embrace.

things are not fully proven. Things are not fully ticked and tied where maybe I came from brands where a lot of things would need to be ticked and tied before we do something or launch this new campaign. Maybe I would have to test it three times with three different focus groups and quantitative. Nope, we just go. And that has been amazing. And I'll tell you, there's a belief in myself that has really come to the forefront.

that I didn't have to rely on at previous big brands. What does that mean? I've done it. I've done it. Not saying that I know how to do all of it moving forward, but I have a real confidence in my understanding of the consumer, the competitive set, how other brands might be thinking so I can almost guerrilla warfare what I would like to do at Rodan and Fields. And I didn't have to rely on that before. I had to rely on

testing, research, ticking and tying everything. Whereas here, because we want to move fast and we are the challenger brand, helping my team to feel comfortable with speed over perfection and being able to anticipate where we think the opportunities for us might be being a challenger brand. That has been super rewarding.

Rose (47:27.246)
Well, you know, they always say, what is it, Wayne Gretzky, you need to skate to where the puck is going, not to the puck. You got to get ahead of the puck. And it really feels like adaptability is that quiet little superpower behind every enduring brand. And without it, you lose. You snooze, you lose. And I love what you're describing. I think if you were to think for yourself,

Anncy Rowe (47:37.139)
Right.

Rose (47:57.47)
your younger self? I love to ask this question. It's my favorite. Knowing what you know now through all of your experiences, what would be the top three things you would now say if you were writing a letter to your younger self? What would you say to that younger self?

Anncy Rowe (48:18.438)
Wow, I mean so many things, but I'll tell you one of the first things.

Rose (48:22.138)
We are going to make it all the way free. Make it however many you like.

Anncy Rowe (48:27.22)
Okay, letter to my younger self, dear younger Ansi, always hire people smarter than you. I really believe Rose in the, do you understand the Voltron analogy? I'm probably totally aging myself, but it's like the, listeners, if you don't know Voltron, the analogy is that our,

Rose (48:42.904)
I do, but explain it to our listeners in case somebody hasn't heard.

Anncy Rowe (48:53.132)
the sum of our parts together are going to be a collective stronger whole. So for me, if acquisition media is not my forte, bring in the best acquisition media marketer that you can have, right? I don't need to know everything. I, quantitative research is not my forte, bring in the best quantitative researcher, know what you need to build and then build an A-class team that

You can just let run. And so for me, Rose, I almost used to have a interview bias back when I was younger of hiring people that like I could see myself relating to. We look at brand the same way. Now I like to hire people so different than me that clearly can be an amazing compliment because when we get together that

debate the way we view things together, we're looking at it from all different angles that is going to get to a better good. So anyway, so that's the Voltron example. So higher, smarter than me, better than me, different capabilities than me. Two, I would say.

Anncy Rowe (50:08.784)
you are going to be the master of your own career. And so that is going to be from a developmental guidance. I used to be that person that would think like, just get your head down, do your work and everything is going to work out for itself.

My advice to my younger self is you're doing amazing work. Make sure you're telling people about it. sure you're showcasing the results of your work. You know, have the conversations, have the coffees. Everyone that is higher up, more higher up, they want to help that next generation. I used to feel like I was such a bother to anyone that I would ask for help from or no, it's none of that. So really just be your best advocate, if you will. That would be my second piece of advice.

And then third piece is...

You know, I had a, remember graduating from business school and I interviewed at this consumer goods company and the VP of marketing there that interviewed me, he offered me the job and I guess he could see hesitation in my face, Rose, because it was like, you know, consumer goods, like pharma world. And maybe I wasn't so excited about these OTC products. And he said, you know, a good marketer, no matter what the

the category should be passionate about their work. And I was like, okay, but guess what, Rose? I didn't go there. And fast forward, I love beauty. And so my advice is go where your passions are. Like there is, when you are working in a field where you are passionate, everything comes 10 times easier. And I've worked in the,

Anncy Rowe (51:57.682)
categories where I was not as passionate. I've worked in categories where I am passionate. And if you have the luxury, and I feel blessed that I got brought down this path, but finding beauty for me was a passion that I didn't know I had. And it just, I just soared. And so my advice to my younger self is go.

Listen to your gut and when you're interviewing, make sure that you are interviewing those around you for culture fit and for what that, you know, what that category might feel like within the culture, within the walls and go there. And so that VP was super nice. And I do believe that any great marketers should be passionate about any category that you're on, but I promise you, if you are personally passionate, everything is going to be just so much easier.

Rose (52:47.63)
I can so relate to that. And you're also touching on something very interesting here, which is if you are linear in your thinking that I have to follow this path this way, it prevents you if you don't have the openness to explore things that are outside your comfort zone. Really, you're talking a lot about leave it open. And if your gut's telling you not quite right, why waste the time?

Because if you have faith and belief in the purpose, in your gut, in your instinct, the right thing will come as long as you keep at it, keep showing up every day, keep looking, it'll come. And that, to me, is a very inspiring message to anyone at any point in their journey and something that we should all really think about just because what's in front of you is what you're pursuing.

doesn't mean there's not this world of abundance. And if you just embrace the world of abundance, magical things can show up when you least expect

Anncy Rowe (53:55.038)
totally agree. I totally agree.

Rose (53:58.2)
Well, Ansi, thank you for really, I say, showing us what transformation actually looks like when it's rooted in, I'd say three things, purpose. I heard you talk about powered by data, that balance between art and science, and driven by heart and human. And there's no AI bot going to take that away. Like that is special with what's being created. And Rodan and Fields is proving.

Anncy Rowe (54:15.794)
Mm-hmm.

Rose (54:26.988)
with much of your leadership, that legacy and reinvention can coexist beautifully. And I think you're building the future of where many brands, whether you're in beauty or you're in some other category, vitamins and supplements, whatever it may be, I think there are so many nuggets of wisdom coming out of this discussion. And I so appreciate you for being so open and honest and just helping our listeners understand.

what potential lives out there and how exciting it can be at exactly this moment in time, being present where we are today in this space.

Anncy Rowe (55:06.26)
Thank you so much, Rose. What a great reminder of the power of purpose in brand building. You really helped to remind me of that throughout the conversation. So thank you. was such a pleasure.

Rose (55:17.634)
Well, for listeners who might want to get in touch with you, follow, I'd say your journey, and I think we're all excited about Rodan and Phil's journey now. How would you like people to watch you, watch the story unfold, get in touch with you, where best to reach you? And we'll make sure we include that in the show notes too.

Anncy Rowe (55:35.076)
Wonderful. Well, so I'm on LinkedIn. I would love to connect with anyone that wants to connect with me. And of course, you can also connect with me on Instagram as well at FancyAnsy.

Rose (55:45.502)
such a delight. I'd love to have you back for a phase two, because I know you have exciting things coming up in 2026. So let's just say this is episode one, and we must do another follow on. And come back and tell us on how things are going. Wonderful. Thank you. Great.

Anncy Rowe (55:47.508)
You

Anncy Rowe (55:53.918)
right.

Anncy Rowe (56:01.287)
It's a date, Rose.

Anncy Rowe (56:05.256)
Thank you.